Women in Science - Online Interviews

Meg Urry

1. Give a brief description of your job telling what you do, (a day in your life) but also what you do specifically in your position.

I have been an astronomer at the Space Telescope Science Institute (STScl) since 1987. STScl carries out the science program of the Hubble Space Telescope for NASA. My scientific research concerns active galaxies, which are galaxies with unusually luminous cores that are likely powered by massive black holes. To understand these objects, I make observations throughout the electromagnetic spectrum, from radio waves to infrared-optical -UV light to X-and gamma rays, using satellite experiments and ground-based observatories. My work on active galaxies focuses on some of the most energetic and catastrophic phenomena known in the universe, and in some recent years I have identified one of the principal causes of this extreme activity: relativistic jets probably formed in the vicinity of supermassive black holes at the heart of active galaxies. In addition, I head the STScl Science Program Selection Office, which solicits HST observing proposals from the international astronomical community and oversees their review and final selection. We do this on a yearly cycle; last year (1995) we called for proposals in June, sending out a thick package of documentation on telescope and instrument capabilities, guidelines for proposing, and additional information. In response, we received over 1000 proposals by the deadline, September 15. These were sent to approximately 100 proposal reviewers-well known astronomers from all over the world-who then met at STScl in November to determine the HST observing patterns for Cycle 6 (observing dates July 1996 through June 1997). Letters of approval and rejection were sent to proposals in December, the approved programs require a second proposal submission(with much more details about the specific observations), due in February/March 1996 time frame. Meanwhile, this January we in SPSO began preparing for the next cycle, writing documentation (and Web pages) describing the new proposal procedures.I have also maintained a long interest in the issue of women in science, and I was the chief organizer of the 1992 conference on Women in Astronomy which led to the Baltimore Charter.

2. How did you decide upon your career? When did you know you wanted to do it and how did you prepare for it?

I decided to be an astronomer much later than many of my colleagues-really not until I applied to graduate school in my senior year at college. I was always interested in science, found physics very challenging, but was also attracted to mathematics, and chemistry(not to mention English, history, languages,..) Following my junior year at college(Tufts University), where astronomy was a very minor part of the physics department, I spent a summer as a student intern at the National Radio Astronomy Conservatory in Charlottesville, Virginia. That was my first real contact in astronomy. It was there I learned how interesting and how much fun an astronomical research could be. The people were fun, too. I saw science not as a solitary pursuit but as a group activity, one that was social as well as rigorous. The following year, I applied to graduate schools in astronomy and physics, and ended up planning to go in the fall to the John Hopkins University department of physics and astronomy, probably to pursue astronomy but still perhaps going into high energy physics or some other field. In the summer before graduate school, I worked with an X-ray astronomy group at the Center for Astrophysics at Harvard. More interesting science, more fun! This confirmed that when I went to John Hopkins, I should look seriously into doing astronomy I later got summer jobs at the nearby Goddard Space Flight Center working with the X-ray astronomy group. This led directly to my thesis research, and the combined scientific excellence and low-key friendliness of that group is probably the reason I got through the stresses and pressures of graduate school. In my experience, college classes, while useful, were never as important as on-the-job experience. What I know and use now in my work, for example, has completly replaced the dated information form my early training. The important thing is the approach, and the constant learning of new skills and constant improvements in understanding.

3. What is the best thing about your job?

The most interesting part of my job is learning new things, making progress toward understanding our universe. Sometimes that gets lost under the day-to day minutiae, which can be very absorbing and also at times boring. But the new thoughts, the new ideas, the exercising of one's brain-those are what makes it all worthwhile.

4. As a kid, what kinds of things did you do to prepare for this job? What books did you read or what things did you do that let you know you would like this field?

I didn't do anything as a kid, frankly, that prepared me for this job. I enjoyed school, was always interested in every subject, advanced in mathematics at every opportunity(which in retrospect, was very important, though I didn't think about it at the time.) I liked reading and writing a great deal, and I think that has helped me in writing scientific papers and with the communications needed to support the HST project. When I was quite young, in 3rd grade or so, I read a lot of biographies, including some of famous women-doctors, scientists,pioneers. Quite frankly, the hardest part of getting to where I am in my career today has been developing the confidence that there IS a role for me, for women, in science, and in overcoming the insidious training I have, as does any girl in our society, to be a quintessentially female: to be self-effacing, to avoid "bragging", to support others even at the expense of taking appropriate credit of oneself-all wonderful, polite things, but very much at odds with the dominant scientific culture today, at least in the U.S. Reading about successful women, especially in fields where they had to fight to establish their right to be there, was a great morale boost and a great support. Finding a few women ahead of me and more in my peer group and even more coming up behind, has been critical to me staying in astronomy.

5. Was there any person (parent, teacher, mentor, professor) you felt influenced you to pursue this field?

My chemistry teacher, Miss Crawley, at Winchester High School in Massachusetts was very important in attracting me to science in the first place. Before that, science was probably the least of my interests. Later as I started college, my parents, and particularly my father, were extremely influential, suggesting that I take physics(something that I might not have thought to do without a push) and always encouraging me. In retrospect, my sisters and brother and I were taught as children to think in a logical, methodical way. I always thought everyone did that! But now I recognize my idea of "normal" as a very standard scientific approach- what do we know? what are the options? What further information do we need to find out in order to figure out the problem? And so on. So my parents prepared me to be a natural scientist.

6. What is your favorite quote?

One of my favorite quotations (which I used in my high school yearbook) sounds kind of snotty, unfortunately, and isn't particularly relevant to the issue of women in science, but it appeals to me because it explains the priority of understanding the truth above other consideration like popularity. It was said by Henry Clay, famous American orator and never President:
"I'd rather be right than be President."
( He got his wish I suppose.) I also like the following quotation, perhaps more directly relevant to science, found in the the book A Short History of Astronomy, by A. Berry (New York, Dover):
"The greater the sphere of our knowledge, the larger the surface of its contact with the infinity of our ignorance."

7. What advice do you have for young women who might be interested in the field of science?

Also difficult! I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, science is a wonderful career, it's fascinating, it pays well, unemployment is almost nonexistent (despite all the moaning and groaning;some people may be slightly underemployed with respect to their skills, but compared to the average liberal arts grads,I'm positive scientists do great, and this can only improve), and it's a lot of fun and filled with interesting smart people. For women, unfortunately, there is a down-side, as there probably is in many field, in that the going is just a little bit tougher. It would be disingenuous to pretend otherwise. But it's getting better all the time, as more women enter the field, and probably by the time an undergraduate of today is achieving tenure 15 or 20 years from now, all this sexist foolishness will be a distant memory. I hope so! So the advice would be: definitely do it if you find it interesting and don't let anything or anyone stop you without putting up a fight. Most important set up a support system of friends, coworkers, fellow students, whoever --- it's much tougher to go it alone --- and if you are interested in having a family, make sure your partner is an enlightened person who respects your aspirations and your career as much as his/her own.

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1.	Give a brief description of your job telling what you do, (a day in your life) but also what you do specifically in your position.
	I have been an astronomer at the Space Telescope Science Institute (STScl) since 1987. STScl carries out the science program of the Hubble Space Telescope for NASA. My scientific research concerns active galaxies, which are galaxies with unusually luminous cores that are likely powered by massive black holes. To understand these objects, I make observations throughout the electromagnetic spectrum, from radio waves to infrared-optical -UV light to X-and gamma rays, using satellite experiments and ground-based observatories. My work on active galaxies focuses on some of the most energetic and catastrophic phenomena known in the universe, and in some recent years I have identified one of the principal causes of this extreme activity: relativistic jets probably formed in the vicinity of supermassive black holes at the heart of active galaxies. In addition, I head the STScl Science Program Selection Office, which solicits HST observing proposals from the international astronomical community and oversees their review and final selection. We do this on a yearly cycle; last year (1995) we called for proposals in June, sending out a thick package of documentation on telescope and instrument capabilities, guidelines for proposing, and additional information. In response, we received over 1000 proposals by the deadline, September 15. These were sent to approximately 100 proposal reviewers-well known astronomers from all over the world-who then met at STScl in November to determine the HST observing patterns for Cycle 6 (observing dates July 1996 through June 1997). Letters of approval and rejection were sent to proposals in December, the approved programs require a second proposal submission(with much more details about the specific observations), due in February/March 1996 time frame. Meanwhile, this January we in SPSO began preparing for the next cycle, writing documentation (and Web pages) describing the new proposal procedures.I have also maintained a long interest in the issue of women in science, and I was the chief organizer of the 1992 conference on Women in Astronomy which led to the Baltimore Charter.
2.	How did you decide upon your career? When did you know you wanted to do it and how did you prepare for it?
	I decided to be an astronomer much later than many of my colleagues-really not until I applied to graduate school in my senior year at college. I was always interested in science, found physics very challenging, but was also attracted to mathematics, and chemistry(not to mention English, history, languages,..) Following my junior year at college(Tufts University), where astronomy was a very minor part of the physics department, I spent a summer as a student intern at the National Radio Astronomy Conservatory in Charlottesville, Virginia. That was my first real contact in astronomy. It was there I learned how interesting and how much fun an astronomical research could be. The people were fun, too. I saw science not as a solitary pursuit but as a group activity, one that was social as well as rigorous. The following year, I applied to graduate schools in astronomy and physics, and ended up planning to go in the fall to the John Hopkins University department of physics and astronomy, probably to pursue astronomy but still perhaps going into high energy physics or some other field. In the summer before graduate school, I worked with an X-ray astronomy group at the Center for Astrophysics at Harvard. More interesting science, more fun! This confirmed that when I went to John Hopkins, I should look seriously into doing astronomy I later got summer jobs at the nearby Goddard Space Flight Center working with the X-ray astronomy group. This led directly to my thesis research, and the combined scientific excellence and low-key friendliness of that group is probably the reason I got through the stresses and pressures of graduate school. In my experience, college classes, while useful, were never as important as on-the-job experience. What I know and use now in my work, for example, has completly replaced the dated information form my early training. The important thing is the approach, and the constant learning of new skills and constant improvements in understanding.
3.	What is the best thing about your job?
	The most interesting part of my job is learning new things, making progress toward understanding our universe. Sometimes that gets lost under the day-to day minutiae, which can be very absorbing and also at times boring. But the new thoughts, the new ideas, the exercising of one's brain-those are what makes it all worthwhile.
4.	As a kid, what kinds of things did you do to prepare for this job? What books did you read or what things did you do that let you know you would like this field?
	I didn't do anything as a kid, frankly, that prepared me for this job. I enjoyed school, was always interested in every subject, advanced in mathematics at every opportunity(which in retrospect, was very important, though I didn't think about it at the time.) I liked reading and writing a great deal, and I think that has helped me in writing scientific papers and with the communications needed to support the HST project. When I was quite young, in 3rd grade or so, I read a lot of biographies, including some of famous women-doctors, scientists,pioneers. Quite frankly, the hardest part of getting to where I am in my career today has been developing the confidence that there IS a role for me, for women, in science, and in overcoming the insidious training I have, as does any girl in our society, to be a quintessentially female: to be self-effacing, to avoid "bragging", to support others even at the expense of taking appropriate credit of oneself-all wonderful, polite things, but very much at odds with the dominant scientific culture today, at least in the U.S. Reading about successful women, especially in fields where they had to fight to establish their right to be there, was a great morale boost and a great support. Finding a few women ahead of me and more in my peer group and even more coming up behind, has been critical to me staying in astronomy.
5.	Was there any person (parent, teacher, mentor, professor) you felt influenced you to pursue this field?
	My chemistry teacher, Miss Crawley, at Winchester High School in Massachusetts was very important in attracting me to science in the first place. Before that, science was probably the least of my interests. Later as I started college, my parents, and particularly my father, were extremely influential, suggesting that I take physics(something that I might not have thought to do without a push) and always encouraging me. In retrospect, my sisters and brother and I were taught as children to think in a logical, methodical way. I always thought everyone did that! But now I recognize my idea of "normal" as a very standard scientific approach- what do we know? what are the options? What further information do we need to find out in order to figure out the problem? And so on. So my parents prepared me to be a natural scientist.
6.	What is your favorite quote?
	One of my favorite quotations (which I used in my high school yearbook) sounds kind of snotty, unfortunately, and isn't particularly relevant to the issue of women in science, but it appeals to me because it explains the priority of understanding the truth above other consideration like popularity. It was said by Henry Clay, famous American orator and never President: "I'd rather be right than be President." ( He got his wish I suppose.) I also like the following quotation, perhaps more directly relevant to science, found in the the book A Short History of Astronomy, by A. Berry (New York, Dover): "The greater the sphere of our knowledge, the larger the surface of its contact with the infinity of our ignorance."
7.	What advice do you have for young women who might be interested in the field of science?
	Also difficult! I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, science is a wonderful career, it's fascinating, it pays well, unemployment is almost nonexistent (despite all the moaning and groaning;some people may be slightly underemployed with respect to their skills, but compared to the average liberal arts grads,I'm positive scientists do great, and this can only improve), and it's a lot of fun and filled with interesting smart people. For women, unfortunately, there is a down-side, as there probably is in many field, in that the going is just a little bit tougher. It would be disingenuous to pretend otherwise. But it's getting better all the time, as more women enter the field, and probably by the time an undergraduate of today is achieving tenure 15 or 20 years from now, all this sexist foolishness will be a distant memory. I hope so! So the advice would be: definitely do it if you find it interesting and don't let anything or anyone stop you without putting up a fight. Most important set up a support system of friends, coworkers, fellow students, whoever --- it's much tougher to go it alone --- and if you are interested in having a family, make sure your partner is an enlightened person who respects your aspirations and your career as much as his/her own.